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	<title>Comments on: US Army View of PreMillennialism Strategic Implications of American Millennialism</title>
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		<title>By: Barb</title>
		<link>http://www.indywatchman.com/2009/12/21/us-army-view-of-premillennialism-strategic-implications-of-american-millennialism/comment-page-1/#comment-646</link>
		<dc:creator>Barb</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Mar 2010 06:02:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.indywatchman.com/?p=563#comment-646</guid>
		<description>(So help me, I just observed this on the worldwide net! - - - Barb)

        PRETRIB RAPTURE SECRECY

             by Dave MacPherson


     The word &quot;secrecy&quot; when applied to Christ&#039;s return can refer to two different things: time and visibility. Before 1830 the only coming Christians looked for was the &quot;every eye shall see him&quot; second advent to earth - secret only in point of time.
     Enter Margaret Macdonald in 1830. She saw &quot;the one taken and the other left&quot; before &quot;THE WICKED&quot; [Antichrist] will &quot;be revealed&quot; - and added that her pretrib rapture would not be &quot;seen by the natural eye&quot; but only by &quot;those who have the light of God within.&quot; Her rapture was doubly secret: at an unknown day and hour and also invisible to &quot;outsiders.&quot;
     Desperate to eliminate Margaret as the pretrib originator and the Irvingites as the first public teachers of pretrib, Darby defender Thomas Ice foolishly claims that they taught a secret POSTTRIB coming even though he knows that when Hal Lindsey teaches &quot;one taken&quot; etc. before the Antichrist &quot;is revealed&quot; Lindsey is expressing the kernel of the pretrib view - what MM and the Irvingites clearly taught before Darby did! Google &quot;X-Raying Margaret&quot; and &quot;Edward Irving is Unnerving&quot; to see why they are properly labeled &quot;pretrib.&quot;)
     As early as June 1832, Irving&#039;s journal taught that only &quot;to those who are watching and praying...will Christ be manifested...as the morning star. To the rest of the church, and to the world, this first appearance will be...unintelligible.&quot; (&quot;Present State of Prophetic Knowledge&quot; etc., p. 374)
     Always trailing and &quot;borrowing&quot; quietly from the Irvingites who in turn had &quot;borrowed&quot; from Margaret, Darby in 1845 finally sounded like them when he wrote that &quot;the bright and morning Star...is the sweet and blessed sign to them that watch...And such is Christ before He appears [at the final advent to earth]. The Sun will arise on the world....The star is before the [Sun], the joy of those who watch. The unwakeful world, who sleep in the night, see it not.&quot; (&quot;Thoughts on the Apocalypse,&quot; p. 167)
     And Lindsey&#039;s &quot;Late Great Planet Earth,&quot; p. 143, says that &quot;the second coming is said to be visible to the whole earth (Revelation 1:7). However, in the Rapture. only the Christians see Him - it&#039;s a mystery, a secret.&quot;  
     My bestselling book &quot;The Rapture Plot&quot; (available at online stores including Armageddon Books) has 300 pages of such documentation and proves that Margaret was the first to &quot;see&quot; a secret, pretrib rapture, that the Irvingites soon echoed her in their journal (which Darby admitted he avidly read), and that Darby was last on all of the crucial aspects of dispensationalism.
     Shockingly, all of the earliest pretrib development rested solely on unclear OT and NT types and symbols and NOT on clear Biblical statements. Margaret&#039;s rapture was inspired by Rev. 11&#039;s &quot;two witnesses.&quot; And her &quot;secret visibility&quot; rested on the &quot;types&quot; of Stephen, Paul, and John - all of whom saw or heard what others couldn&#039;t see or hear.
     For 30 years Darby&#039;s pretrib basis was the rapture of Rev. 12&#039;s &quot;man child&quot; - actually his plagiarism of Irving&#039;s usage of this &quot;pretrib&quot; symbol eight years earlier!
     As I said at the start, the &quot;second advent to earth&quot; is secret in point of time with its unknown &quot;day and hour,&quot; as Christ stated. Pretribs assert that if Christ returns for the church after the tribulation, we could count down the days and figure out the actual date of His return - which would contradict Christ&#039;s words.
     But pretribs deliberately ignore the fact that Christ said that the tribulation days will be shortened - and He didn&#039;t reveal the length of the shortening!
     Our opponents also assume that the &quot;watch&quot; verses prove the &quot;any-moment imminence&quot; of Christ&#039;s return. But do they? II Peter 3:12 says we are to be &quot;looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God&quot; which all premills claim is at least 1000 years ahead of us and therefore hardly &quot;imminent&quot;! What&#039;s the difference between &quot;watching for&quot; and &quot;looking for&quot;?
     Another gimmick has pretribs saying &quot;Would you want Jesus to return at any moment and find out you&#039;re sinning?&quot; But Jesus ALREADY knows all about us! And the Holy Spirit, who&#039;s also God, is ALREADY here (Rom. 8:27)!
     You have just learned a few of the many secrets that the Secret Rapture Gang has hidden for a long time. Evidently they have forgotten Luke 12:2&#039;s warning that &quot;there is nothing covered, that shall not be revealed&quot;!
     PS - For the ultimate in uncovered secrets, see engines like Google and type in &quot;Pretrib Rapture Dishonesty.&quot;
     PPS - While evangelicals stay largely asleep while waiting for their 180-year-old rapture, the shmutzy-tongued subversives of the world (e.g., movie moguls at awards ceremonies) invent new ways to create and unite even more members of the FFA (Future Followers of the Antichrist). For insights Yahoo &quot;backstabbing tirades by David Letterman (and Sandra Bernhard and Kathy Griffin)&quot; in a short Letterman bit.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>(So help me, I just observed this on the worldwide net! &#8211; - &#8211; Barb)</p>
<p>        PRETRIB RAPTURE SECRECY</p>
<p>             by Dave MacPherson</p>
<p>     The word &#8220;secrecy&#8221; when applied to Christ&#8217;s return can refer to two different things: time and visibility. Before 1830 the only coming Christians looked for was the &#8220;every eye shall see him&#8221; second advent to earth &#8211; secret only in point of time.<br />
     Enter Margaret Macdonald in 1830. She saw &#8220;the one taken and the other left&#8221; before &#8220;THE WICKED&#8221; [Antichrist] will &#8220;be revealed&#8221; &#8211; and added that her pretrib rapture would not be &#8220;seen by the natural eye&#8221; but only by &#8220;those who have the light of God within.&#8221; Her rapture was doubly secret: at an unknown day and hour and also invisible to &#8220;outsiders.&#8221;<br />
     Desperate to eliminate Margaret as the pretrib originator and the Irvingites as the first public teachers of pretrib, Darby defender Thomas Ice foolishly claims that they taught a secret POSTTRIB coming even though he knows that when Hal Lindsey teaches &#8220;one taken&#8221; etc. before the Antichrist &#8220;is revealed&#8221; Lindsey is expressing the kernel of the pretrib view &#8211; what MM and the Irvingites clearly taught before Darby did! Google &#8220;X-Raying Margaret&#8221; and &#8220;Edward Irving is Unnerving&#8221; to see why they are properly labeled &#8220;pretrib.&#8221;)<br />
     As early as June 1832, Irving&#8217;s journal taught that only &#8220;to those who are watching and praying&#8230;will Christ be manifested&#8230;as the morning star. To the rest of the church, and to the world, this first appearance will be&#8230;unintelligible.&#8221; (&#8220;Present State of Prophetic Knowledge&#8221; etc., p. 374)<br />
     Always trailing and &#8220;borrowing&#8221; quietly from the Irvingites who in turn had &#8220;borrowed&#8221; from Margaret, Darby in 1845 finally sounded like them when he wrote that &#8220;the bright and morning Star&#8230;is the sweet and blessed sign to them that watch&#8230;And such is Christ before He appears [at the final advent to earth]. The Sun will arise on the world&#8230;.The star is before the [Sun], the joy of those who watch. The unwakeful world, who sleep in the night, see it not.&#8221; (&#8220;Thoughts on the Apocalypse,&#8221; p. 167)<br />
     And Lindsey&#8217;s &#8220;Late Great Planet Earth,&#8221; p. 143, says that &#8220;the second coming is said to be visible to the whole earth (Revelation 1:7). However, in the Rapture. only the Christians see Him &#8211; it&#8217;s a mystery, a secret.&#8221;<br />
     My bestselling book &#8220;The Rapture Plot&#8221; (available at online stores including Armageddon Books) has 300 pages of such documentation and proves that Margaret was the first to &#8220;see&#8221; a secret, pretrib rapture, that the Irvingites soon echoed her in their journal (which Darby admitted he avidly read), and that Darby was last on all of the crucial aspects of dispensationalism.<br />
     Shockingly, all of the earliest pretrib development rested solely on unclear OT and NT types and symbols and NOT on clear Biblical statements. Margaret&#8217;s rapture was inspired by Rev. 11&#8242;s &#8220;two witnesses.&#8221; And her &#8220;secret visibility&#8221; rested on the &#8220;types&#8221; of Stephen, Paul, and John &#8211; all of whom saw or heard what others couldn&#8217;t see or hear.<br />
     For 30 years Darby&#8217;s pretrib basis was the rapture of Rev. 12&#8242;s &#8220;man child&#8221; &#8211; actually his plagiarism of Irving&#8217;s usage of this &#8220;pretrib&#8221; symbol eight years earlier!<br />
     As I said at the start, the &#8220;second advent to earth&#8221; is secret in point of time with its unknown &#8220;day and hour,&#8221; as Christ stated. Pretribs assert that if Christ returns for the church after the tribulation, we could count down the days and figure out the actual date of His return &#8211; which would contradict Christ&#8217;s words.<br />
     But pretribs deliberately ignore the fact that Christ said that the tribulation days will be shortened &#8211; and He didn&#8217;t reveal the length of the shortening!<br />
     Our opponents also assume that the &#8220;watch&#8221; verses prove the &#8220;any-moment imminence&#8221; of Christ&#8217;s return. But do they? II Peter 3:12 says we are to be &#8220;looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God&#8221; which all premills claim is at least 1000 years ahead of us and therefore hardly &#8220;imminent&#8221;! What&#8217;s the difference between &#8220;watching for&#8221; and &#8220;looking for&#8221;?<br />
     Another gimmick has pretribs saying &#8220;Would you want Jesus to return at any moment and find out you&#8217;re sinning?&#8221; But Jesus ALREADY knows all about us! And the Holy Spirit, who&#8217;s also God, is ALREADY here (Rom. 8:27)!<br />
     You have just learned a few of the many secrets that the Secret Rapture Gang has hidden for a long time. Evidently they have forgotten Luke 12:2&#8242;s warning that &#8220;there is nothing covered, that shall not be revealed&#8221;!<br />
     PS &#8211; For the ultimate in uncovered secrets, see engines like Google and type in &#8220;Pretrib Rapture Dishonesty.&#8221;<br />
     PPS &#8211; While evangelicals stay largely asleep while waiting for their 180-year-old rapture, the shmutzy-tongued subversives of the world (e.g., movie moguls at awards ceremonies) invent new ways to create and unite even more members of the FFA (Future Followers of the Antichrist). For insights Yahoo &#8220;backstabbing tirades by David Letterman (and Sandra Bernhard and Kathy Griffin)&#8221; in a short Letterman bit.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Earl</title>
		<link>http://www.indywatchman.com/2009/12/21/us-army-view-of-premillennialism-strategic-implications-of-american-millennialism/comment-page-1/#comment-483</link>
		<dc:creator>Earl</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Dec 2009 04:44:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.indywatchman.com/?p=563#comment-483</guid>
		<description>[Articles like this one which I found on the web are the real shocks in this world!]

   FAMOUS RAPTURE WATCHERS - Addendum
                          
                    by Dave MacPherson                        


(The statements in my &quot;Famous Rapture Watchers&quot; web article appeared in my 1983 book &quot;The Great Rapture Hoax&quot; and quoted only past leaders. The following names include other leaders who were quoted in that original printing.)

     Oswald J. Smith: &quot;...I am absolutely convinced that there will be no rapture before the Tribulation, but that the Church will undoubtedly be called upon to face the Antichrist...&quot; (Tribulation or Rapture - Which?, p. 2).

     Paul B. Smith: &quot;You are perfectly free to quote me as believing rather emphatically in the post-tribulation teaching of the Bible&quot; (letter dated June 9, 1976).

     S. I. McMillen: &quot;...Christians will suffer in the Great Tribulation&quot; (Discern These Times, p. 55).

     Norman F. Douty: &quot;...all of the evidence of history runs one way - in favor of Post-tribulationism&quot; (Has Christ&#039;s Return Two Stages?, p. 113).

     Leonard Ravenhill: &quot;There is a cowardly Christianity which...still comforts its fainting heart with the hope that there will be a rapture - perhaps today - to catch us away from coming tribulation&quot; (Sodom Had No Bible, p. 94).

     William Hendriksen: &quot;...the one and only second coming of Christ to judgment&quot; (Israel in Prophecy, p. 29).

     Loraine Boettner: &quot;Hence we conclude that nowhere in Scripture does it teach a secret or pre-tribulation Rapture&quot; (The Millennium, p. 168).

     J. Sidlow Baxter: &quot;...believers of the last days (there is only one small part of the total Church on earth at any given moment) will be on earth during the so-called &#039;Great Tribulation&#039; &quot; (Explore the Book, Vol. 6, p. 345).

     Merrill C. Tenney: &quot;There is no convincing reason why the seer&#039;s being &#039;in the Spirit&#039; and being called into heaven [Revelation 4:1-2] typifies the rapture of the church...&quot; (Interpreting Revelation, p. 141).

     James R. Graham: &quot;...there is not a line of the N.T. that declares a pre-tribulation rapture, so its advocates are compelled to read it into certain indeterminate texts...&quot; (Watchman, What of the Night?, p. 79).

     Ralph Earle: &quot;The teaching of a pre-tribulation rapture seems first to have been emphasized widely about 100 years ago by John Darby of the Plymouth Brethren&quot; (Behold, I Come, p. 74).

     Clarence B. Bass: &quot;...I most strongly believe dispensationalism to be a departure from the historic faith...&quot; (Backgrounds to Dispensationalism, p. 155).

     William C. Thomas: &quot;The return of Jesus Christ, described by parousia, revelation, and epiphany, is one single, glorious, triumphant event for which we all wait with great eagerness!&quot; (The Blessed Hope in the Thessalonian Epistles of Paul, p. 42).

     Harold J. Ockenga: &quot;No exegetical justification exists for the arbitrary separation of the &#039;coming of Christ&#039; and the &#039;day of the Lord.&#039; It is one &#039;day of the Lord Jesus Christ&#039; &quot; (Christian Life, February, 1955).

     Duane Edward Spencer: &quot;Paul makes it very clear that the Church will pass through the Great Tribulation&quot; (&quot;Rapture-Tribulation&quot; cassette).

     J. C. Maris: &quot;Nowhere the Bible teaches that the Church of Jesus Christ is heading for world dominion. On the contrary - there will be no place for her, save in &#039;the wilderness,&#039; where God will take care of her (Rev. 12:13-17)&quot; (I.C.C.C. leaflet &quot;The Danger of the Ecumenical Movement,&quot; p. 2).

     F. F. Bruce: &quot;To meet the Lord [I Thessalonians 4:17]...on the final stage of...[Christ&#039;s] journey...to the earth...&quot; (New Bible Commentary: Revised, p. 1159).

     G. Christian Weiss: &quot;Some people say that this [&#039;gospel of the kingdom&#039; in Matthew 24:14] is not the gospel of grace but is a special aspect of the gospel to be preached some time in the future. But there is nothing in the context to indicate this&quot; (&quot;Back to the Bible&quot; broadcast, February 9, 1976).

     Pat Brooks: &quot;Soon we, in the Body of Christ, will be confronted by millions of people disillusioned by such false teaching [Pre-Tribism]&quot; (Hear, O Israel, p. 186).

     Herman Hoeksema: &quot;...the time of Antichrist, when days so terrible are still to arrive for the church...&quot; (Behold, He Cometh!, p. 131).

     Ray Summers: &quot;Because they [Philadelphia] have been faithful, he promises his sustaining grace in the tribulation...&quot; (Worthy Is the Lamb, p. 123).

     George E. Ladd: &quot;[Pretribulationism] may be guilty of the positive danger of leaving the Church unprepared for tribulation when Antichrist appears...&quot; (The Blessed Hope, p. 164).

     Peter Beyerhaus: &quot;The Christian Church on earth [will face] the final, almost superhuman test of being confronted with the apocalyptical temptation by Antichrist&quot; (Christianity Today, April 13, 1973).

     Leon Morris: &quot;The early Christians...looked for the Christ to come as Judge&quot; (Apocalyptic, p. 84).

     Dale Moody: &quot;There is not a passage in the New Testament to support Scofield. The call to John to &#039;come up hither&#039; has reference to mystical ecstasy, not to a pretribulation rapture&quot; (Spirit of the Living God, p. 203).

     John R. W. Stott: &quot;He would not spare them from the suffering [Revelation 3:10]; but He would uphold them in it&quot; (What Christ Thinks of the Church, p. 104).

     G. R. Beasley-Murray: &quot;...the woman, i.e., the Church...flees for refuge into the wilderness [Revelation 12:14]...&quot; (The New Bible Commentary, p. 1184).

     Bernard L. Ramm: &quot;...as the Church moves to meet her Lord at the parousia world history is also moving to meet its Judge at the same parousia&quot; (Leo Eddleman&#039;s Last Things, p. 41).

     J. Barton Payne: &quot;...the twentieth century has indeed witnessed a progressively rising revolt against pre-tribulationism&quot; (The Imminent Appearing of Christ, p. 38).

     Robert H. Gundry: &quot;Divine wrath does not blanket the entire seventieth week...but concentrates at the close&quot; (The Church and the Tribulation, p. 63).

     C. S. Lovett: &quot;Frankly I favor a post-trib rapture...I no longer teach Christians that they will NOT have to go through the tribulation&quot; (PC, January, 1974).

     Walter R. Martin: &quot;Walter Martin finally said...&#039;Yes, I&#039;m a post-trib&#039; &quot; (Lovett&#039;s PC, December, 1976).

     Jay Adams: &quot;Today&#039;s trend is...from pre- to posttribulationism&quot; (The Time Is at Hand, p. 2).

     Jim McKeever: &quot;Nowhere do the Scriptures say that the Rapture will precede the Tribulation&quot; (Christians Will Go Through the Tribulation, p. 55).

     Arthur Katz: &quot;I think it fair to tell you that I do not subscribe to the happy and convenient theology which says that God&#039;s people are going to be raptured and lifted up when a time of tribulation and trial comes&quot; (Reality, p. 8).

     Billy Graham: &quot;Perhaps the Holy Spirit is getting His Church ready for a trial and tribulation such as the world has never known&quot; (Sam Shoemaker&#039;s Under New Management, p. 72).

     W. J. Grier: &quot;The Scofield Bible makes a rather desperate effort...it tries to get in the &#039;rapture&#039; of the saints before the appearing of Antichrist&quot; (The Momentous Event, p. 58).

     Pat Robertson: &quot;Jesus Christ is going to come back to earth again to deliver Israel and at the same time to rapture His Church; it&#039;s going to be one moment, but it&#039;s going to be a glorious time&quot; (&quot;700 Club&quot; telecast, May 14, 1975).

     Ben Kinchlow: &quot;Any wrath [during the Tribulation] that comes upon us - any difficulty - will not be induced by God, but it&#039;ll be like the people are saying, &#039;The cause of our problems are those Christians in our midst; we need to get rid of them&#039; &quot; (&quot;700 Club&quot; telecast, August 28, 1979).

     Daniel P. Fuller: &quot;It is thus concluded that Dispensationalism fails to pass the test of an adequate system of Biblical Interpretation&quot; (The Hermeneutics of Dispensationalism, p. 369).

     Corrie ten Boom: &quot;The Bible prophesies that the time will come when we cannot buy or sell, unless we bear the sign of the Antichrist...&quot; (Tramp for the Lord, p. 187).

     Francis Nigel Lee (eleven earned doctorates!): &quot;Dave MacPherson, in his various books, has made a major contribution toward vindicating Historic Christian Eschatology. The 1830 innovations of the disturbed Margaret Macdonald documented by MacPherson - in part or in whole - immediately spread to Edward Irving and his followers, then to J. N. Darby and Plymouth Brethrenism, and were later popularized by the dispensationalistic Scofield Reference Bible, by Classic Pentecostalism, and by latter-day pretribulationists like J. F. Walvoord and Hal Lindsey.&quot;

[In light of II Tim. 3:14 which says that we can&#039;t know too much about Bible teachers (Dave MacVersion), I invite you to read my article &quot;Pretrib Rapture Dishonesty&quot; which can be found on the &quot;Powered by Christ Ministries&quot; site.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[Articles like this one which I found on the web are the real shocks in this world!]</p>
<p>   FAMOUS RAPTURE WATCHERS &#8211; Addendum</p>
<p>                    by Dave MacPherson                        </p>
<p>(The statements in my &#8220;Famous Rapture Watchers&#8221; web article appeared in my 1983 book &#8220;The Great Rapture Hoax&#8221; and quoted only past leaders. The following names include other leaders who were quoted in that original printing.)</p>
<p>     Oswald J. Smith: &#8220;&#8230;I am absolutely convinced that there will be no rapture before the Tribulation, but that the Church will undoubtedly be called upon to face the Antichrist&#8230;&#8221; (Tribulation or Rapture &#8211; Which?, p. 2).</p>
<p>     Paul B. Smith: &#8220;You are perfectly free to quote me as believing rather emphatically in the post-tribulation teaching of the Bible&#8221; (letter dated June 9, 1976).</p>
<p>     S. I. McMillen: &#8220;&#8230;Christians will suffer in the Great Tribulation&#8221; (Discern These Times, p. 55).</p>
<p>     Norman F. Douty: &#8220;&#8230;all of the evidence of history runs one way &#8211; in favor of Post-tribulationism&#8221; (Has Christ&#8217;s Return Two Stages?, p. 113).</p>
<p>     Leonard Ravenhill: &#8220;There is a cowardly Christianity which&#8230;still comforts its fainting heart with the hope that there will be a rapture &#8211; perhaps today &#8211; to catch us away from coming tribulation&#8221; (Sodom Had No Bible, p. 94).</p>
<p>     William Hendriksen: &#8220;&#8230;the one and only second coming of Christ to judgment&#8221; (Israel in Prophecy, p. 29).</p>
<p>     Loraine Boettner: &#8220;Hence we conclude that nowhere in Scripture does it teach a secret or pre-tribulation Rapture&#8221; (The Millennium, p. 168).</p>
<p>     J. Sidlow Baxter: &#8220;&#8230;believers of the last days (there is only one small part of the total Church on earth at any given moment) will be on earth during the so-called &#8216;Great Tribulation&#8217; &#8221; (Explore the Book, Vol. 6, p. 345).</p>
<p>     Merrill C. Tenney: &#8220;There is no convincing reason why the seer&#8217;s being &#8216;in the Spirit&#8217; and being called into heaven [Revelation 4:1-2] typifies the rapture of the church&#8230;&#8221; (Interpreting Revelation, p. 141).</p>
<p>     James R. Graham: &#8220;&#8230;there is not a line of the N.T. that declares a pre-tribulation rapture, so its advocates are compelled to read it into certain indeterminate texts&#8230;&#8221; (Watchman, What of the Night?, p. 79).</p>
<p>     Ralph Earle: &#8220;The teaching of a pre-tribulation rapture seems first to have been emphasized widely about 100 years ago by John Darby of the Plymouth Brethren&#8221; (Behold, I Come, p. 74).</p>
<p>     Clarence B. Bass: &#8220;&#8230;I most strongly believe dispensationalism to be a departure from the historic faith&#8230;&#8221; (Backgrounds to Dispensationalism, p. 155).</p>
<p>     William C. Thomas: &#8220;The return of Jesus Christ, described by parousia, revelation, and epiphany, is one single, glorious, triumphant event for which we all wait with great eagerness!&#8221; (The Blessed Hope in the Thessalonian Epistles of Paul, p. 42).</p>
<p>     Harold J. Ockenga: &#8220;No exegetical justification exists for the arbitrary separation of the &#8216;coming of Christ&#8217; and the &#8216;day of the Lord.&#8217; It is one &#8216;day of the Lord Jesus Christ&#8217; &#8221; (Christian Life, February, 1955).</p>
<p>     Duane Edward Spencer: &#8220;Paul makes it very clear that the Church will pass through the Great Tribulation&#8221; (&#8220;Rapture-Tribulation&#8221; cassette).</p>
<p>     J. C. Maris: &#8220;Nowhere the Bible teaches that the Church of Jesus Christ is heading for world dominion. On the contrary &#8211; there will be no place for her, save in &#8216;the wilderness,&#8217; where God will take care of her (Rev. 12:13-17)&#8221; (I.C.C.C. leaflet &#8220;The Danger of the Ecumenical Movement,&#8221; p. 2).</p>
<p>     F. F. Bruce: &#8220;To meet the Lord [I Thessalonians 4:17]&#8230;on the final stage of&#8230;[Christ's] journey&#8230;to the earth&#8230;&#8221; (New Bible Commentary: Revised, p. 1159).</p>
<p>     G. Christian Weiss: &#8220;Some people say that this ['gospel of the kingdom' in Matthew 24:14] is not the gospel of grace but is a special aspect of the gospel to be preached some time in the future. But there is nothing in the context to indicate this&#8221; (&#8220;Back to the Bible&#8221; broadcast, February 9, 1976).</p>
<p>     Pat Brooks: &#8220;Soon we, in the Body of Christ, will be confronted by millions of people disillusioned by such false teaching [Pre-Tribism]&#8221; (Hear, O Israel, p. 186).</p>
<p>     Herman Hoeksema: &#8220;&#8230;the time of Antichrist, when days so terrible are still to arrive for the church&#8230;&#8221; (Behold, He Cometh!, p. 131).</p>
<p>     Ray Summers: &#8220;Because they [Philadelphia] have been faithful, he promises his sustaining grace in the tribulation&#8230;&#8221; (Worthy Is the Lamb, p. 123).</p>
<p>     George E. Ladd: &#8220;[Pretribulationism] may be guilty of the positive danger of leaving the Church unprepared for tribulation when Antichrist appears&#8230;&#8221; (The Blessed Hope, p. 164).</p>
<p>     Peter Beyerhaus: &#8220;The Christian Church on earth [will face] the final, almost superhuman test of being confronted with the apocalyptical temptation by Antichrist&#8221; (Christianity Today, April 13, 1973).</p>
<p>     Leon Morris: &#8220;The early Christians&#8230;looked for the Christ to come as Judge&#8221; (Apocalyptic, p. 84).</p>
<p>     Dale Moody: &#8220;There is not a passage in the New Testament to support Scofield. The call to John to &#8216;come up hither&#8217; has reference to mystical ecstasy, not to a pretribulation rapture&#8221; (Spirit of the Living God, p. 203).</p>
<p>     John R. W. Stott: &#8220;He would not spare them from the suffering [Revelation 3:10]; but He would uphold them in it&#8221; (What Christ Thinks of the Church, p. 104).</p>
<p>     G. R. Beasley-Murray: &#8220;&#8230;the woman, i.e., the Church&#8230;flees for refuge into the wilderness [Revelation 12:14]&#8230;&#8221; (The New Bible Commentary, p. 1184).</p>
<p>     Bernard L. Ramm: &#8220;&#8230;as the Church moves to meet her Lord at the parousia world history is also moving to meet its Judge at the same parousia&#8221; (Leo Eddleman&#8217;s Last Things, p. 41).</p>
<p>     J. Barton Payne: &#8220;&#8230;the twentieth century has indeed witnessed a progressively rising revolt against pre-tribulationism&#8221; (The Imminent Appearing of Christ, p. 38).</p>
<p>     Robert H. Gundry: &#8220;Divine wrath does not blanket the entire seventieth week&#8230;but concentrates at the close&#8221; (The Church and the Tribulation, p. 63).</p>
<p>     C. S. Lovett: &#8220;Frankly I favor a post-trib rapture&#8230;I no longer teach Christians that they will NOT have to go through the tribulation&#8221; (PC, January, 1974).</p>
<p>     Walter R. Martin: &#8220;Walter Martin finally said&#8230;&#8217;Yes, I&#8217;m a post-trib&#8217; &#8221; (Lovett&#8217;s PC, December, 1976).</p>
<p>     Jay Adams: &#8220;Today&#8217;s trend is&#8230;from pre- to posttribulationism&#8221; (The Time Is at Hand, p. 2).</p>
<p>     Jim McKeever: &#8220;Nowhere do the Scriptures say that the Rapture will precede the Tribulation&#8221; (Christians Will Go Through the Tribulation, p. 55).</p>
<p>     Arthur Katz: &#8220;I think it fair to tell you that I do not subscribe to the happy and convenient theology which says that God&#8217;s people are going to be raptured and lifted up when a time of tribulation and trial comes&#8221; (Reality, p. 8).</p>
<p>     Billy Graham: &#8220;Perhaps the Holy Spirit is getting His Church ready for a trial and tribulation such as the world has never known&#8221; (Sam Shoemaker&#8217;s Under New Management, p. 72).</p>
<p>     W. J. Grier: &#8220;The Scofield Bible makes a rather desperate effort&#8230;it tries to get in the &#8216;rapture&#8217; of the saints before the appearing of Antichrist&#8221; (The Momentous Event, p. 58).</p>
<p>     Pat Robertson: &#8220;Jesus Christ is going to come back to earth again to deliver Israel and at the same time to rapture His Church; it&#8217;s going to be one moment, but it&#8217;s going to be a glorious time&#8221; (&#8220;700 Club&#8221; telecast, May 14, 1975).</p>
<p>     Ben Kinchlow: &#8220;Any wrath [during the Tribulation] that comes upon us &#8211; any difficulty &#8211; will not be induced by God, but it&#8217;ll be like the people are saying, &#8216;The cause of our problems are those Christians in our midst; we need to get rid of them&#8217; &#8221; (&#8220;700 Club&#8221; telecast, August 28, 1979).</p>
<p>     Daniel P. Fuller: &#8220;It is thus concluded that Dispensationalism fails to pass the test of an adequate system of Biblical Interpretation&#8221; (The Hermeneutics of Dispensationalism, p. 369).</p>
<p>     Corrie ten Boom: &#8220;The Bible prophesies that the time will come when we cannot buy or sell, unless we bear the sign of the Antichrist&#8230;&#8221; (Tramp for the Lord, p. 187).</p>
<p>     Francis Nigel Lee (eleven earned doctorates!): &#8220;Dave MacPherson, in his various books, has made a major contribution toward vindicating Historic Christian Eschatology. The 1830 innovations of the disturbed Margaret Macdonald documented by MacPherson &#8211; in part or in whole &#8211; immediately spread to Edward Irving and his followers, then to J. N. Darby and Plymouth Brethrenism, and were later popularized by the dispensationalistic Scofield Reference Bible, by Classic Pentecostalism, and by latter-day pretribulationists like J. F. Walvoord and Hal Lindsey.&#8221;</p>
<p>[In light of II Tim. 3:14 which says that we can&#8217;t know too much about Bible teachers (Dave MacVersion), I invite you to read my article &#8220;Pretrib Rapture Dishonesty&#8221; which can be found on the &#8220;Powered by Christ Ministries&#8221; site.</p>
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